A lot of ground to cover boys. Not saying it is impossible, but the knicks need to start winning on the road and the knicks need to start having winning streaks larger than two, more often than twice. Atlanta and Indiana are surprise teams so far. 57 games to be played, but the urgency is on now. Please, no more 5 or 8-game losing streaks.
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Good stuff Blogzilla!!!
Atlanta is my sleeper this year…plus if the Knicks have another 8 game losing streak…the season will be officially over.
REPOST ALERT REPOST ALERT
LOL @ Mambo Sauce……
That game is going to be great.
Yeah Peaceman they did sweep the Lakers last year but Kobe didn’t play in the NY game
and in the LA game he had 31 points and we won on a beautiful last second alley to Curry.
After the game, Kobe was praising Jamal saying he is a good talent and that he can create
well for himself and others.
The Lakers got the ball back with time to score after the Curry oop but Kobe never got the
ball and was only used as a decoy for the last play. Marbs played good D on Lamar to help
us seal the W. That was a beautiful night LOL!!!!
Maybe Thomas has opened his eyes and has finally saw the light.
Wait….who am I kidding right?
Tomorrow the Mamba goes to Cleveland to pay King James a visit.
Let’s see if Lebron is still star struck when he plays Lord of the Rings.
Oh I almost forgot…..
IT WILL BE TELEVISED ON NATIONAL TV!!!
8 O’clock buddy on TNT.
Should be interesting to see what Kenny and Chuck have to say about that match up.
I think tomorrows game deserves a special post knicksdefense.
It’s a off night for us Knicks and it’s the best 2 players in the game matching up
against one another.
We should all watch that game and give our collective thoughts.
Maybe I’m just day dreaming…
This site is called knicksdefense but correct me if I’m wrong….we can always talk
about basketball related events.
Big win tonight and big game tomorrow.
Google Alert – new york knicks Thu 12/20/2007 2:09 AM
F
ans give New York Knicks coach Thomas a giant pink slip
Knicks host LeBron, Cavs
What’s missing in Cleveland?
Knicks fan Jason Silverstein removed from seat for sign
Curry denies Knicks win ‘guarantee’
‘NY Daily News’ Prints ‘Fire Isiah’ Sign Aimed at New York Knicks …
Cleveland 90 New York 108
Thomas set with 2 week ultimatum
Knicks Fans Take to the Streets
The New York Knicks Will Not Tolerate Your Taunts
Artest considers Knicks move
We must put forth our best effort to go 3-1 and finish out 2007!
If we don’t have our infamous mental lapse and steal one against the Magic,
it will be a very promising New Year! Let’s go Knicks!
Once again I would like to thank all the protesters that helped the Knicks
play the best game of this season! Let’s go Protesters!
Defenders
The effort of yesterdays game did alot to heal the bruises.
But to answer MODI’s question.
I will return to Orange and Blue when the Knicks play with the intensity they played with last night on a consistent basis.
But if the Knicks go on a tear- winning streak of over five games or a winning trend where they go 7-3 or above in a ten game period- then I’ll also return to Orange and Blue.
I wonder if the pink slips used by the protesters is an indication of their sexual orientation?
Maybe!
Frank Isola needs to take reading comprehension classes.
The turd misinterpreted a statement by Isiah so as to spin a story that Isiah is sour on his own hiring.
Here’s a sample
‘Isiah Thomas spent so much time on Wednesday night defending himself and making a case that the Knicks have a brighter tomorrow that he inadvertently criticized the club’s decision to hire him four years ago.
When asked about the possibility of making changes, Thomas told reporters before Wednesday night’s 108-90 victory over Cleveland: “This isn’t the time to really stop and evaluate and judge because right now, this is the time where teams make mistakes, managers make mistakes. And you end up making a mistake that will set you back another three or four years. We put ourselves in a position where we do have a brighter future.”
Of course, it was at this time of year four years ago when the Knicks made the decision to replace Scott Layden with Thomas. Also, Thomas’ signature deal, acquiring Stephon Marbury from Phoenix, was done in early January.’
If you read Thomas’ statement, what he’s actually doing is making a statement that it would set the team back 3-4 years to have a knee jerk reaction and can him right now.
Isola is really Drossman!
The editors really write his posts!
Isola is just a patsy! He’s dyslexic!
Let it be known that Isola is really Drossman!
Indy, I figured they had it in em if they could just keep it together; Dunleavy’s breakout year is helping a lot (Tinsley, too). Atlanta is fun to watch with rook Horford making a starter of himself; Bucks had a good start but seem to be fading back to expected mediocrity; it’ll be interesting to see if Chicago can put together a run to put them right back in it; but the biggest surprise for me at this point is Washington — i mean, whaaaaat, with agent zero out of commission? Who saw that coming?
The league’s gone past the one-quarter pole, the preludes are over, everyone’s fully warmed up and knows their part. Let’s see how this all plays out. Giddyup! LGK!
Mamba will have 50 tonight…
Remember I said that.
You heard it here first and he will shut down Lebron. (hold under 25)
I think they should buy that big pink slip off the good doc and bring it w/ them everywhere they go. Make it a symbol of the “us against the world” attitude that they should have. We talked about that in the preseason and now we need that attitude more than ever.
So nobody answered my question from the last thread.
Steph and Malik will be traded in the off season. What should we be focussing on getting w/ 28 million in expiring contracts ?
**Counter Protest** Cancel your subscription to all newspapers. Put the pressure back on them.
Knicks win in most convincing, energetic fashion and MSM focus is on “fans” holding “Fire Isiah” signs. I agree with Jay Bee that the boobirds and “Fire Isiah” crowd are primarily the creation of the MSM tabloid hacks who despise both Zeke and Dolan for restricting their access to the team. In the interview following last night’s game, D. Lee said that he viewed the win against Cleveland as a commited team effort, reflecting high intensity and pure determination to prevail. Lee encouraged the fans to “stay positive” — something many of us who contribute to this blog have been saying for some time. KFL
Great win last night.
funny how the MSM is saying that we won because Cleveland was coming in from an overtime win 2 days earlier. Are they just mischievous or they honestly lack the brain-power to do analytical thinking? They forgot to mention that Knicks were without Steph.
Anyway, I just hope Q will play with that intensity and confidence in the next games. That will really free up ZBo, Lee and Curry. One other observation that I made was the speed and flow of the game seem sto favour Q. Steph returns to the lineup tomorrow and I have to hold my breath. I hope I hope it works out well. Charlotte is really playing well but if we bring the same intensity as last night, we will prevail.
What up Defenders!
Great night at the Mecca last night.
I met Greg Anthony last night, and he’s small. I was suprised. They realy cheat on their stated height.
He’s not 6’2″.
I saw a few folks with the Daily news “Fire Isiah” sign, but none during the game.
They left the Garden with dirty hands from the newspaper ink and no opportunity to display them.
Ever so often a few sheep would TRY to start the “Fire Isiah” chant, only to have the masses look back at them in disgust.
The chants faded quite quickly. That was so funny to observe, I was loving it.
Observations.
If you looked at the game closely, you’d see that Zeke blinked.
For long stretches, he played a conventional line-up with Q at the two.
He had Craw with Q and Jefferies.
He had Nate with Q and Jefferies.
I think that was key to the easy BLOWOUT win last night. He probably read our comments here on Knickdefense.
Curry actually showed promise on defense.
His rotations were there, and he was active on the covers.
I’ve been saying for a long time that Craw and Marbury cannot be a winning backcourt with Q at the three, and I think I’m right. With Jones actively playing defense at the two, it allows Craw to relax at the point. It also helped that Gibson is not a scoring or agressive point.
I still mantain that Craw or Marbury should start, not both.We need a heavy dose of Jefferies at the three.
The conventional line-up gives a us a much better defensive presence.
More observations later.
Barf:
Glad to see that you’re now seeing my point on trading Zach. Zach’s a very good player, but he’s not our primary need.
He has stunted the growth of many players from that agressive last year’s team, and his long jump shots and isolations kills the flow.
Sometimes the best player is not necessarily the best player for that particular team.
Marbury is a very good example.
Zeke won’t trade Zach, so I’ll let it rest.
Good to see the crew in good spirit. Let’s keep it flowing.
Remain steady Defenders, the road is long and tiring, but that only makes it sweeter when we get to the promosed land.
AF,
We’ve been saying the same things here for a while. Most of us know that JC and Steph is not a great starting backcourt. Zeke may be starting to realize that himself. Let’s hope he now sees what we all see and makes the proper adjustments.
@ African…
And Zeke would do well NOT to trade Zach, either.
Agreed, his iso’s and long jumpers may kill the flow at times, but he brings something we don’t have a lot of….
Heart and the desire to win.
I believe the elixir to what ails the Knicks is reduced minutes from Steff (also agree with your Steph/Jamal analysis….Craw can handle the point, which I’ve pointed out before) and giving Jones more playing time. In Jones, you have a guy that ENJOYS playin’ D…a rarity in our backcourt.
Hopefully Zeke is not just talkin’ the talk. He needs to maintain what he has here, and not play players to justify his prowess as a GM.
Is it possible that Kobe will make a stink in the off season again and instead of letting him walk for nothing they trade him to us for the 28 mill in expiring contracts (Steph and Malik) plus a few others ? Am I just pipe dreaming ?
I like how you think JohnQ!!!
(Singing voice)
it’s the mamba…mamba on the run
and he’s scoring like he’s never scored before
it’s the mamba….mamba on the run
and he’s scoring like he’s never scored before
(back to regular voice)
He is going to destroy Cleveland tonight just to make a statement against
King James.
50 or better.
The best scorer of all time!!!
Kobe Bryant
LeBron backs embattled Isiah Thomas
James says fan outrage misplaced, hints coach is right about players
By Brian Windhorst
Beacon Journal sportswriter
Published on Thursday, Dec 20, 2007
NEW YORK: There aren’t many of them around the Big Apple these days, but count LeBron James as an Isiah Thomas sympathizer.
While the tabloids whip the enraged Knicks fan base into a frenzy calling for the coach and president’s head, James made it clear Wednesday that he feels the blame might be misplaced. He even came close to agreeing with Thomas’ statements earlier this week that challenged the highly paid Knicks’ overall effort level.
”Sometimes they just don’t play hard. It’s more times they don’t play hard than they do,” James said. ”It would never happen, I would never allow my team not to have effort. You have to have a leader in the locker room; a coach can only do so much. . . . You do feel bad (for Isiah) a little bit, but I don’t know what goes on around here and I don’t want to get involved.”
Conspiracy theorists suggest and many Knick fans dream that they could somehow get James to play in New York someday, which is why his opinion will no doubt carry weight and why it’s sought out by the giant local media.
James, who normally does not attack other players and keeps his trash talking to the court, has bared fangs at Knicks players before. Earlier this season, he said he could never play with Stephon Marbury, the face of the fractured Knicks franchise. It was about the strongest negative statement James has ever made about an opposing player.
Now he says the Knicks players, some of whom hinted to media outlets they were offended by Thomas’ remarks, need to take Thomas’ comments as motivation.
”You don’t feel offended, you go out there and prove him wrong,” James said.
”There’s been times Mike Brown has said things to us that we didn’t like and we went out the next game and proved him wrong. Or he was trying to fire us up to make us better. You don’t take it personal; we’re grown men.”
Regardless of James’ opinions, the outspoken Thomas bashers are winning the public-relations war right now. The Knicks are off to a terrible start following three terrible seasons of missing the playoffs. There have been reported fights on the team jet, players getting kicked out of practice and a steady stream of underwhelming play.
It has gotten downright toxic at Madison Square Garden, where chants urging Thomas’ immediate firing happen nightly.
On Wednesday alone, the New York tabloids carried pictures on their front pages of a courtside ticket holder who was ejected from Monday’s game for holding up a ”Fire Isiah” sign. The Daily News, which seems to be in an all-out war with Knicks management, ran a full page ”Fire Isiah” sign it encouraged fans to bring to the game.
Wednesday morning, there was a rally outside the arena at which signatures were gathered on an eight-foot tall pink slip with Thomas’ name on it.
”You can’t knock the fans. They want a winning ballclub and someway, somehow they should get one,” James said. ”You can’t screen out what is going on here. You don’t want to get involved in it, but you can’t tune it out just because you are part of the NBA and you know what goes on around the NBA.”
——————————————————————————–
Brian Windhorst can be reached at bwindhor@thebeaconjournal.com. Read his blog at http://www.ohiomm.com/blogs/cavs/.
NEW YORK: There aren’t many of them around the Big Apple these days, but count LeBron James as an Isiah Thomas sympathizer.
While the tabloids whip the enraged Knicks fan base into a frenzy calling for the coach and president’s head, James made it clear Wednesday that he feels the blame might be misplaced. He even came close to agreeing with Thomas’ statements earlier this week that challenged the highly paid Knicks’ overall effort level.
”Sometimes they just don’t play hard. It’s more times they don’t play hard than they do,” James said. ”It would never happen, I would never allow my team not to have effort. You have to have a leader in the locker room; a coach can only do so much. . . . You do feel bad (for Isiah) a little bit, but I don’t know what goes on around here and I don’t want to get involved.”
Conspiracy theorists suggest and many Knick fans dream that they could somehow get James to play in New York someday, which is why his opinion will no doubt carry weight and why it’s sought out by the giant local media.
James, who normally does not attack other players and keeps his trash talking to the court, has bared fangs at Knicks players before. Earlier this season, he said he could never play with Stephon Marbury, the face of the fractured Knicks franchise. It was about the strongest negative statement James has ever made about an opposing player.
Now he says the Knicks players, some of whom hinted to media outlets they were offended by Thomas’ remarks, need to take Thomas’ comments as motivation.
”You don’t feel offended, you go out there and prove him wrong,” James said.
”There’s been times Mike Brown has said things to us that we didn’t like and we went out the next game and proved him wrong. Or he was trying to fire us up to make us better. You don’t take it personal; we’re grown men.”
Regardless of James’ opinions, the outspoken Thomas bashers are winning the public-relations war right now. The Knicks are off to a terrible start following three terrible seasons of missing the playoffs. There have been reported fights on the team jet, players getting kicked out of practice and a steady stream of underwhelming play.
It has gotten downright toxic at Madison Square Garden, where chants urging Thomas’ immediate firing happen nightly.
On Wednesday alone, the New York tabloids carried pictures on their front pages of a courtside ticket holder who was ejected from Monday’s game for holding up a ”Fire Isiah” sign. The Daily News, which seems to be in an all-out war with Knicks management, ran a full page ”Fire Isiah” sign it encouraged fans to bring to the game.
Wednesday morning, there was a rally outside the arena at which signatures were gathered on an eight-foot tall pink slip with Thomas’ name on it.
”You can’t knock the fans. They want a winning ballclub and someway, somehow they should get one,” James said. ”You can’t screen out what is going on here. You don’t want to get involved in it, but you can’t tune it out just because you are part of the NBA and you know what goes on around the NBA.”
that commercial with the car salesman dancing might be one of the
funniest commercials of all time.
that e-bay commercial is pretty funny also…the one where the guy and lady are racing
at the stand and the guy wins the red corvette.
I just saw Superbad last night and it instantly goes down as a classic movie.
I know I’m all off the subject right now but we got a great game to look forward to
tonight.
Somebody here said they are going to the Laker game on the 23rd. Have a good time and
make sure you tell your childrens children that you got to see the greatest scorer of all time in
his prime.
”There’s been times Mike Brown has said things to us that we didn’t like and we went out the next game and proved him wrong. Or he was trying to fire us up to make us better. You don’t take it personal; we’re grown men.”
That’s old school right there. I’m diggin this cat. Regardless of his motivation, it’s time we see men instead of boys play ball and deal with the stage it is played on.
DVJ,
Kobe needs to pay you.
There will be some agressive nail biting tonight on the Cleveland bench.
Marbury not expected to make trip to Charlotte
GREENBURGH, N.Y. — New York Knicks point guard Stephon Marbury did not practice Thursday and is not expected to travel to Friday’s game at Charlotte.
The team said Marbury was absent because of a combination of flu-like symptoms and personal reasons. Marbury’s father died Dec. 2 after becoming ill while attending a game at Madison Square Garden, and Marbury has missed six of the last nine games.
Marbury was in uniform for Wednesday’s win over Cleveland but did not play. He had rejoined the team Sunday and played Monday, but didn’t practice Tuesday on what would have been his father’s birthday.
JohnQ:
You’re not only pipe dreaming, you’re also smoking a pipe. With crack in it.
No way are the Lakers trading Kobe for thrash. That’s why I hate speculating on trades. We want to better our team, but so does the other teams. Plus we’re in a buyers’ market. 15 cents on the dollar.
BX:
I don’t think he would, but that’s only my opinion to improve these Knicks.
There’s no need for you to agree.
Q needs to play at the two and allow Jefferies/Balk/Chandler man the three.
I could understand if the crowd started chanting Kobe Kobe Kobe instead of Fire Isiah.
It’s very important to have the best player in a particular sport play in NY…
Just ask the Yankees!!!!
Let me clarify my statements…
Kobe is the best scorer ever…not the best player ever.
Mike is the best ever but he was not a better scorer.
I tell you this much….if LBJ keeps playing the way he is…
he will go down as the greatest player ever.
I have all the skills Kobe has but he’s 6 foot 6…
I’m only 6 foot 1…that’s why I didn’t make the NBA LOL…
When are we going to get together and play some ball together guys?
We can see who really walks the walk and talks the talk.
DeVonn,
Have you been sippin’ this afternoon?
DVJ,
That’s not an excuse. At least you are taller than N8 and Boykins.
Anyway. IT’s backers are growing. Is there a chance that we will one day see Jermaine Oneal and Lebron playing for the Knicks. Yeah!! I will keep dreaming.
I think it is good that Marbury will not play tomorrow. He needs to be healthy and hungry for ball before he steps back on the court. The team needs to play with the same fire and desire as last night. Jason Richardson will be the min problem.
AF,
I know its far fetched but what if the Lakers see that there is no equal value in the NBA and decide to blow it up ??? That could start w/ getting rid of Kobe and acquiring 28 mill in outgoing contracts. Just bloggin’ of course but I can dream.
John Q..
Why you fuggin’ wif African????
DVJ,
That car commercial is hysterical. I laugh every time he thrusts toward the car as a sales pitch ! Thats where the Mamba tune came from in the previous thred too huh ?
I saw Superbad a few weeks ago. You are 100% right. Instant Classic !
How about when McLovin tells the other guys ” I told her what time it was !” I fell down laughing on that one.
BX boy,
How am I fuggin w/ him ? We just bloggin’
We all have been down on Q for his poor shooting, but he has been one of our better defenders and rebounders.
Not only that, but he also guards the three as an undersized player.
After guarding the team’s best player, who’s bigger than you, how much legs would you have for the offensive end?
We need Q at the two, and Jefferies at the three.
Results? A 6 game winning streak.
LOL @ John Q…
You know how AF feels about hypothetical trade talks, that’s why….
BX:
I’m cool as the other side of the pillow. No beef just veggies.
Did you guys hear that Stu Scott has cancer?
He’s not critical, but he would need chemo.
Af,
I love that quote “cool as the other side of the pillow”. That was a great family guy episode. Billy D….. ” Hellllllllo Peter, welcome to the other side of the pillow”
hahahahahahaha
I didn’t know he had cancer. He does have that bad eye that always seems to be watching me. Like on Scooby Doo when they walk past a picture. Creepy.
Ha Ha Ha.
JB that was wrong man! But funny.
JohnQ:
Stu always use that line.
Modi: Thanks for the reenforcement. It will take ongoing pressure from us to counter the relentless MSM endeavor to
undermine Zeke and intimidate Dolan into
selling the franchise. J.D. will hopefully keep ignoring the insidious media rants and picket mongers, and the players will see what is really going on, responding, as they did last night, by playing with sustained energy and determination.
Did you guys know that Stuart Scott got his eye like that from trying out in the NFL?
He tried out for the Jets as a wide receiver and one day going over the middle for a
catch he got hit. It may sound crazy but that’s real talk.
Almost game time guys!!
I’ll be cheering for Miami tonight as they play our cross town rivals and we all know
who I’ll be cheering for in the first game of the back to back.
You guys might want to record this game….I feel something big will happen tonight.
Yeah JohnQ…that movie is crazy. The big kid was the best though.
The way he was dancing with that girl when she put the blood on his shorts was literally
one of the funniest movie scenes I ever saw. Ranks up there with Coming to America in the barbershop and
also Harlem Nights in the beginning (spell check) of the movie with Samuel Jackson, Richard Pryor, Redd Foxx,
Renaldo Ray and Robin Harris. Damn…it was a lot of talent at that table. 4 of them have passed away but they
will always be remembered. Eddie Murphy, Charlie Murphy, Arsenio Hall…..man that movie was stacked from top
to bottom. If you don’t own it…I suggest getting it because it is a classic.
I never liked him but what happened to Zo last night was sad. Even after the battles we went through with him and
the Heat….when he beat that liver disease you had to cheer for him. His emotion on the floor when they were playing
for the Chip was great to see and I’m glad he was able to win one before he had to call it quits.
MODI
I was reading your site today since I haven’t had time to check it out and man oh man…you truly have a gift brother.
Your writing is great!!!
Not only do you give valid points but you also back those points up with hardcore facts.
I Tivo Around the Horn and PTI everyday. How right you are about the Around the Horn guys and how we should treat them
like they work for the National Enquirer LOL….Good shit.
If Steph plays tomorrow…we will lose…period.
@Jazz…. I play just like Kobe. When I’m on the court you can’t tell me I ain’t Kobe.
Don’t let me hit one of them fade aways…that’s when my Kobe swagger goes up about 10 notches.
We should all link up at that 24 hour gym one weekend. Maybe we’ll get lucky and see a Knick down there.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Marbury is bought out for $30-35 mil. He seems like he really doesn’t want to play anymore. Flu-like symptoms, not the flu? I’m not buying it.
COPY AND PASTE TIME !!!
From ESPN
When people talk about “the best player in the game,” two names come up more than any others these days: Kobe Bryant and LeBron James.
With LeBron’s Cavs hosting Kobe’s Lakers tonight (ESPNRadio.com, 7:35 ET), we asked our experts to compare and contrast the NBA’s greatest individual talents.
Here are their thoughts:
1. Fifteen seconds left, down by 2. Who do you want with the ball?
Henry Abbott, TrueHoop: I’ll take Kobe Bryant, because of the experience factor. He might jack something wild with a defender’s hand in his face, but I know there is absolutely no chance whatsoever that he will get rattled, panic, lose track of the clock, let an ounce of doubt enter his assassin’s psyche, nor give the ball to Donyell Marshall.
J.A. Adande, ESPN.com: For a “must-score” possession I’d take Kobe Bryant over LeBron James or any current or historical NBA great. Yes, even the Managing Member of Basketball Operations for the Charlotte Bobcats. If the play breaks down, Bryant has the resourcefulness and athletic ability to create his own shot. And he’s the best tough-shot shooter in the game. Ever. Case(s) in point.
Chris Broussard, ESPN Mag: Kobe. He’s proved time and time again on the biggest of stages that he can come through in the clutch. This is no knock on LeBron, but right now, Kobe’s the clear answer. Obviously, Kobe can score under pressure, but he’s also got all the tools to make a great pass or create for a teammate as well.
Ric Bucher, ESPN Mag: Kobe, because, as Stephen Jackson recently noted, he has no tendencies. He can score in every way imaginable. LeBron doesn’t even have a consistent midrange game yet and his 3-point range remains streaky. Getting him to give up the ball isn’t even all that hard because he’d rather make the pass than the shot.
John Hollinger, ESPN.com: I’d want Kobe in this situation, for a couple reasons. First, he’s a little better as a pure scorer. Second, he’s a better foul shooter, which in this situation is pretty important since I’d need him to make both just to tie. Third, I have a better shot at getting a 3 with him and winning the game outright.
Kobe vs. LeBron
It’s your turn to chime in. Who rules the here and now? Who is the better leader? Who would claim victory in a fierce game of H.O.R.S.E.? What if they were traded straight up? Vote!
Chris Sheridan, ESPN.com: On the road, I go with Kobe because he’s the guy who is going to be best able to free himself for a 3-point shot, and since we’re on the road, we’re going for the win. If I’m at home and I’m playing for the tie, I want LeBron, because he is going to be able to either get to the bucket, get to the line or draw so many defenders that it’ll leave a shooter open at the 3-point line.
Marc Stein, ESPN.com: Remember Game 4 of the Phoenix series in 2006? From the second Kobe chased down that ball in the backcourt, you knew he was going to win the game at the buzzer. If you were there or just watching on TV, you knew what was coming and you knew the shot was going in. No other player inspires that kind of confidence in the clutch.
2. Who’s the better leader?
Abbott: Their teammates would know best. I’m quite certain that if you had dosed Andrew Bynum with truth serum last summer, and asked him this question, he would have quickly said, “LeBron James.”
Adande: We haven’t seen the implied dismissal of teammates from LeBron that we did from Kobe all last summer — despite the fact Kobe has more to work with than LeBron. It was as if Kobe did not realize that saying you wanted better players around you was a slap in the face to the guys who are already wearing your uniform. He must have missed that leadership lesson.
Broussard: LeBron. His encouragement of, and belief in, his teammates clearly lifts their level of play. Because he exudes so much confidence in them — whether they miss the shot or not — they play with a confidence, a certainty and a swagger that players of mediocre ability often lack. Kobe’s improved as a teammate this season, but LeBron’s the easy winner here.
[+] EnlargeAP Photo/Jeff Lewis
From the looks of things here, at least, Kobe’s getting along fine with his Laker teammates.
Bucher: Kobe, because he doesn’t take plays or games off. LeBron has made huge strides since last season, but just when I was ready to take a seat on his wagon, he missed two weeks with a sprained knuckle on his nonshooting hand while Kobe didn’t miss a minute with shoulder and groin injuries.
Hollinger: LeBron by default. Not because he’s a great leader, but I mean … has he ever lobbied for having his franchise center traded (or failed to lobby against it, depending on whom you believe)? Has he ever mailed in the second half of a Game 7? Has he ever given the impression that he cares about being the star more than winning?
Sheridan: I’ll take LeBron, although I wouldn’t say either of these guys is a traditional leader. But James is the better player in terms of getting his teammates involved and making everyone around him a better player. Kobe is more of a one-man, I-am-the-show type of player.
Stein: They both have leadership questions to answer. The claim that other players don’t want to play with Kobe is overblown — I know plenty who do — but he does get down on some teammates and hasn’t gotten L.A. out of Round 1 sans Shaq and L.A.’s other three-peat vets. LeBron, meanwhile, was undeniably brilliant against Detroit, but the Cavs’ ride couldn’t have extended to the Finals if they weren’t in the East. I think even LeBron would concede that he still has lots to learn here.
3. What is the key difference between them?
Abbott: They are both essentially perfect, so it’s hard to nitpick. But … age, size, health, strength and team focus all favor James. In part because of that size, James can make a living getting to the cup, whereas Bryant is living on a diet of long balls, pull-ups, breakaways and lobs.
Adande: The key difference between them still was best expressed by LeBron himself in an interview with ESPN The Magazine: He doesn’t have that instinct to go out and (metaphorically) kill everyone the way Kobe does. If Kobe smelled blood he’d want to dig deeper into the wound; LeBron would want to get the person a bandage. That would make LeBron more of a humanitarian. On the basketball court, it’s better to be coldhearted.
Kobe vs. LeBron Head-to-Head
Kobe LeBron
Wins 3 4
PPG 24.7 26.0
RPG 4.3 6.9
APG 4.1 7.0
Broussard: They’re totally different players. Kobe is more of an individual performer (like MJ), and LeBron is more of a team performer (like Magic). Kobe’s game is far prettier, much more graceful and he’s a better defender. LeBron’s got more power and better court vision. Kobe’s got more of a killer instinct, but LeBron’s growing in that department.
Bucher: LeBron is bigger, faster and arguably stronger with every skill imaginable. But he doesn’t have Kobe’s fire or anything close to his ability to adjust at a moment’s notice and general knowledge of the game. This whole comparison is at least a year and maybe two, too early.
Hollinger: Size. Kobe looks like an NBA shooting guard; LeBron looks like an NFL defensive lineman. This translates into their playing style — LeBron on the drive simply overpowers people, while Kobe relies more on his leaping and improvisational skills.
Sheridan: Basketballwise, probably their shooting ability — although LBJ is light-years ahead of where he was when he came into the league. Off the court, there is a likability issue with Kobe that doesn’t seem to exist for LeBron. Don’t get me wrong, because they’re both likable in general. But Kobe has a side of him that is dislikable to some people; whereas those who don’t like LBJ do not necessarily dislike him.
Stein: Experience is a biggie, obviously. LeBron has the physical gifts to do more things than Kobe (as a passer and rebounder) and achieve anything in this game, but Kobe has seen so many more situations. Work ethic is worth mentioning, too. Not because LeBron’s is subpar, but I’m pretty sure Kobe would be a landslide winner if we did a survey seeking out the NBA’s most driven player.
4. Choose one: Kobe’s previous 10 years, or LeBron’s next 10 years?
Abbott: I’m an optimist; I’ll bet on the unknown. (Although if I’m thinking like a GM, the argument for taking Bryant is strong, because at least you know he stayed with the team for the full decade.)
Adande: I’d rather have Kobe’s first 10 than LeBron’s next 10. If I get Kobe’s first decade I’m assured of getting three championship-worthy performances. Yes, they came with Shaquille O’Neal around, but in every case Bryant showed he was capable of playing at the game’s highest level when it was demanded. We have one trip to the Finals for LeBron, in which he shot 36 percent. He should do better next time, but will he? Will there even be a next time? I’ll take the known. Kobe.
[+] EnlargeRocky Widner/NBAE via Getty Images
How will the next 10 years of LeBron James’ career look?
Broussard: LeBron’s next 10. Statistically, LeBron’s putting up numbers that only Oscar has matched. And the scary thing is that as great as he is, he’s still got much room for growth. He can still develop a dominant post game and improve his jump shot, foul shooting and defense. Plus, he’s absolutely terrific at making his teammates better. Last season, he took a would-be lottery team (without him) to the Finals. And even though Kobe’s got more offensive weapons in his arsenal, LeBron can score as well as him and anyone else in the league. Case in point, he’s averaging a league-best 30 without even trying to be a huge scorer.
Bucher: LeBron could and should be the first player in the modern era to average a triple-double. His leadership and D have improved dramatically from last season and he certainly could be the league’s best player some day. But Kobe has won three rings. Kobe has been the best player in the league three years running, at least. Will LeBron win three rings? The odds are against it. Erase the drama — and admittedly it would take a big eraser — and give me Kobe’s last 10.
Hollinger: LeBron. At age 22 he had a better PER (player efficiency rating) than any season of Kobe’s career, and this season he’s widening that gap. He doesn’t even need to improve — he just needs to play like he is now for a decade and it will be an easy call.
Sheridan: It depends a lot on where the next 10 years take LeBron, and there are no guarantees he’ll remain in Cleveland, so I’ll have to go with Kobe and the three championships he has already won.
Stein: NBA GMs are always seduced by the unknown. And with LeBron’s seemingly limitless ceiling, I imagine most teams would pick LeBron’s future compared to what we’ve already seen from Kobe, banking on the idea that LeBron’s shooting (from the perimeter and the line) and his defense can only improve from here and make him more special from here.
5. Who is the better player now? Is he the greatest player in the NBA now?
Abbott: The other night, Bryant caught the ball on the perimeter. Andres Nocioni did something strange: He put his stomach right into Bryant’s right side. Translation: Go left, and the world is your oyster, but I will not allow you to go right. Allowing Kobe Bryant to get loose on his way to the hoop? Never! What did Bryant do? Steam like a freight train for a dunk? Not even close. He took a bunny step to the left, picked up his dribble, and pump-faked a 3.
Nocioni wasn’t interested, and now Bryant was stranded with no dribble. So Bryant faked again. Still the defender would not cooperate by fouling him, or getting airborne. Finally Bryant launched the same shot he had faked twice, with a hand in his face. Air ball.
Bryant may be a little hurt. He may be coasting in this part of the season. But no way is he playing better than James right now. If I had first pick of current NBA players, I’d do what I did in my fantasy draft, and that’s select LeBron James.
Career Comparison
Kobe LeBron
Seasons 12 5
PPG 24.7 26.9
RPG 5.2 6.7
APG 4.5 6.5
All-Star Games 9 3
NBA titles 3 0
Adande: Kobe is a better player … but LeBron is playing better. It’s like Alicia Keys; she’s a great musical talent, but she has not made any truly great songs. Bryant has a more complete skill set. However, over the past calendar year, James has put his talents to better use and done a better job of performing the ultimate task: taking your team as far as possible.
As the reigning champ, Tim Duncan still gets the nod overall. But this season LeBron has been playing like Oscar Robertson, while Kobe has been playing more like LeBron. That gives the edge to LeBron.
Broussard: Kobe would win a game of one-on-one and a checklist of skills, but all things being equal (including age), I’d rather have LeBron on my team. A few weeks ago, I would have said LeBron without hesitation, but Kobe has really been a great team player this season. Like LeBron has always done, Kobe’s scored more in the flow of the offense and made his teammates better. Still, LeBron’s better statistically and superior in the intangibles. Kobe’s often surrounded by team-distracting drama. Not so with LeBron.
Bucher: For anyone who plays or coaches or manages in the league — including LeBron and every other member of the Cavs’ organization — this is not even a point of contention. But here’s stating the obvious: Kobe.
Hollinger: As you could probably guess from my previous answer … LeBron. It’s commonly said that Kobe is the game’s best player, and there definitely have been nights where that’s true (the 81 game, for instance), but let’s look at full seasons here. There’s only one season in his entire career where you could even argue that Kobe was the game’s best that season, which was 2005-06 … and LeBron was just as good. Kobe is a better on-ball defender and a superior scorer, but his advantages aren’t large here and LeBron beats him pretty soundly in the other phases.
Sheridan: Kobe is the best player in the NBA and the better player of the two, but not by much. And if LeBron continues to work on his game with the same vigor as Kobe has always shown, LeBron will be a better player at the peak of his career than Kobe was/is at his peak.
Stein: Don’t see how anyone could dispute that Kobe is more fully formed at this stage and thus “better” than LBJ. But “greatest player in the NBA” means “greatest winner” to me. And that’s Tim Duncan. TD has four rings, with at least three different supporting casts, and essentially prevented San Antonio from losing the Spurs. No active player has done more for a franchise.
Hay, Defenders,
I have an idee; who’s in favor of making our own sign saying KEEP ISIAH, we shouldn’t the NY MSM and these boo birds have all the mouth.
The only thing I’m trying to figure out, where did that boobird with the giant pink slip get that made? I’m willing to donate a purchase of such a sign, and willing to sign my moniker on it as well. We should form our own protest in support of our Knicks team and their beleaguered coach.
I bet we get no love from the NY MSM if that happens. The good attention we can bring to this website is worth the effort, I say. And with this site there’s a link to other posters who thoughts are worth reading.
Just an idea, asking for all who’s in favor of it…?
WriteON!!!
Anti-NYSportsNews
I’m with you Anti….
Where do I sign up?
DaVonn Jefferson,
#29 was the questions that got me interested! INDEED x 10!!!! lol
I play winter ball in Carmine– a state recreational center—near Houston and Vecsy, and a two blocks from the A train West Forth and the famous b-ball court.
For the Rec it’s a $75 dollars a year, which includes indoor pool,indoor track,one full court and two half courts,a weight room,and excercise bike.
They call me Tiger over there at Carmines and West 4th park—because people say I look like Tiger Woods, but I play like David Lee with a better jump shot and rebounds like him.
Let me know Davonne if you’re interested, and anyone else here for that matter, i give you guys more info and the days i play there.
Anti: You know I’m there.
@Anti
Good idea,I’m a big fan of IT. However,if this team continues to lose,someone has to go.Unless IT makes a trade or can get this team to go on a 6,7,8 game winning steak,then this group has to change and yes,IT will be the easiest person to replace.I really want to see him complete this and have the Knicks win.
The facts are,we are losing,and this group of guys are not getting it done.And IT is responsible for bringing ALL the players here.
They(Dolan) will have no choice but to start with IT and if we continue not to win break up the players. I don’t think at this point IT has the green light on adding other players based on what’s happening now.
And remember he still has that ABS thing which is turning a lot of loyal Knicks fans off.
BUT,don’t get me wrong,I’m for IT to stay. I think it’s the players that have to step up.Step up like they did last night.
He can only call the players out so many times before they(the players)take responsibilty.And if he can’t motivate them anymore,then another coach/GM will have to try to.
Hard facts:
1)No one wants Marbury(19mill) or Curry(8mill).
2)There are many overpaid players we can’t trade(JJames,JJefferies,MRose,Q,Crawford)each making 5-8million.
There maybe only be one way to start to right this ship.I wish it wasn’t IT,but that’s what it will be.
All the big $$$$ players won’t matter IF we start winning.
DVJ,
Samuel (foot to the ass) Jackson was in Harlem Nights ? What character did he play ?